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047: Women Supporting Women

Hello! Welcome to episode 47 of I’d Rather Stay In. This week, we are discussing our thoughts and some misconceptions around the idea of women supporting women.

Quick links

Women knits life-size Thanos

Jameela Jamil on Instagram

Myth of the Queen Bee (Atlantic article)

Sheryl Sandberg on the Myth of the Catty Woman (NYT article)

How to be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings

Big Friendship: How We Keep Each Other Close

All about candy roaster squash

Episode transcript

Welcome to I’d rather stay in the podcast for cozy introverts. We’re your hosts, Megan Myers and Stephie Predmore. This week’s episode, women supporting women.

Megan, Megan Stephie I have two things to say. The first is that we received our mail in ballots today. Oh, that’s exciting. So we can do our voting stuff. Like made sure to put them on my desk in a safe space a so I wouldn’t lose them but also be so they wouldn’t get any schmutz on them. Because I heard if they have schmutz on them, they like don’t accept them or, you know, some bullshit. So that’s Thing number one. Thing number two, is in a very different direction. Before we hopped onto record, I was scrolling through Facebook, and in a group that I’m in, like a crafting group that I’m in someone posted this video, this woman’s boyfriend challenged her to knit a life size Thanos from the Avengers. And she did he was like, eight feet tall.

And it was fucking wild.

It was wild thing. It’s like the cuz it seems like it took her months. Because it was the video was sort of like a compilation where they had clearly taken like video of her doing it over the course of the month. And at various points she’s like, and somebody said that I should do did it or like so it seemed like maybe it was something she was sharing along the way, like on histogram or Reddit or who the fuck knows. Because she was like, clearly getting feedback from people because she when she made the gauntlet and put the Infinity like knitted little Infinity Stones, somebody was like, Oh, you should do it so that they have Velcro and they can come in and out and blah, blah, blah. And so she’s like, so yeah, that was a great idea. So then I like unstitched them and like put them did the Velcro bow blah. But it seems like it took her months and that she had multiple people like chiming in on this situation. And like her dad got involved and made it that like made this like stand thing so it could actually stand up. It was wild, she had to stuff his body with like, all the bags of polyfill she used like a dubay She’s literally like got a cheap TV and like cut it up and rolled it up and like stuffed his body with the too vague cover like this shit. On the arm that has the gauntlet on it, her boyfriend asked like, wanted her to make it so that it lit up like it did when he put the gauntlet on or whatever. So she got these lights and then like stitch them in and now she’s like explain it in the in the video. She goes Yes, I know. This is stupid. So funny. I mean, I guess like, I don’t know if this. I assume this must This is some sort of like recent thing that happened. Like maybe it was like a quarantine project. I don’t know. But it would be an excellent quarantine project. But anyway, I just watched that I was like, Oh my God, I’ve got to tell everybody about this.

How many points in time? Do you think she was like, This is stupid? I am not gonna finish this. I give up? I don’t

know, I would. It would be like almost every point in time for me,

right? But then you’d be like, but I have to finish it.

The wild thing too is this woman I mean, she she has to be an incredible knitter because she was making the entire pattern as she went, like she like first she had to get a she like got a picture of Thanos had to, like do the math to figure out like, Okay, he’s like eight, because our boyfriends like, he’s like eight foot three. So for girls, he would know that of course a boy would know that. So had to figure out like, Okay, if he’s eight foot three, like you can see where they clearly did the math to figure out like how big his head should be and how big his torso should be and like all the different things. So she had to do a lot of math and like figuring out like, Okay, how to do his clothes and just all of the things it was it was pretty incredible.

So like our his clothes like she can take them off.

I know they’re only like one piece Okay, it’s all like knitted like a little mess

because that was gonna be like stuff. Because if she could take off the gauntlet

that would be wildy but she like went ahead and just like made it all I think she was probably like this that would be a two to or two to four and then it becomes like a like a Ken doll situation. Right? What? What do you what do you do down there? What do I do? I knit a giant Thanos penis or do I just not? I don’t know. That’s a sentence I never thought out of my mouth. But there it is. You guys. Oh my god. It’s it’s.

We have to have this. We’re gonna link this in our show notes because it is enormous.

You found it. Okay. I did

in the room? No, she like put it up outside because it didn’t fit in their apartment. To be fair, like, well, not to be fair. I was gonna say something. Well, there it looks. It looks a little different Jean pictures. I don’t know. I was gonna say it almost looks like Thanos is crossed with

depressed Thor.


he’s a very very large large creation

is a large creation is this this is not a small undertaking.

That is that is absolutely crazy.

Yeah. So it was pretty funny.

Yeah, I I also love that.

Like, like, if you google just like woman knits giant Thanos. Like it’s, uh, you can find it on a like a Reddit so Reddit thing? I don’t know what those are called. My husband’s the one that does read it. Not me. But anyway, it’s like this called next fucking level. Oh, it’s funny. Anyway, how much yarn did you use? I mean, who would have to be all of the on all of it? literally all of it.

That’s crazy. I don’t know.

It’s very funny. It’s theater. Enormous fear. Enormous. It’s crazy. I was just met. I was brushing my teeth mesmerized by this video.

What do you do with it though? Now? Like, I mean, it

doesn’t fit in their apartment.

I don’t know. She can mail it to James Burrell.

The most enormous box ever.

Excuse me,

Mr. Braun. Here’s a very large thing for you.

Nope, not not at all.

Thank you for sharing this with us.

Your well I just I watched I was like, I’m so glad I’m watching this right before we record because I have to get on and tell everyone about his you know, all the like, useless knowledge that I acquire. And one of them is did you know that one time a woman a life size Thanos

bless her.

Because I’m sure her boyfriend probably said it and like, oh my god. Yeah, I bet you and do that.

Yeah, or like, you know, you need something to do I got a project for you.

Haha. And then she was like, okay, Challenge accepted.

I mean, so since May. So that’s like, actually not as long as you would think. But depends on how many like hours a day she spent.

I mean, yeah, there is that like to shoot? Or does she have a job? Like what you know, like, there’s a lot I just I have a lot of questions.

Yeah. I

prefer not to have questions. It’s hard not to ask the questions. I will probably never have answers to the questions but you know, there it is. So well, we’ll link to it in the show notes because it is pretty crazy. It’s pretty great. So you are here now here being Illinois.

Hi Am I am in my house.

So exciting. We are not podcasting in the same room yet although that is yet soon to come we have to figure out the technological side of that but I’m very excited to that’ll be like a whole that will be like a whole new level.

Yeah, that’ll be fun. It’s not just the technology like we have to figure out where we’re actually going to be for that as well. We have the space here I just need to know figure out like what that actually

right there’s like Lego logistics guys.

Yes. Everyone have carpeting in here yet people so

yeah, you’ve been waiting on new carpet so you haven’t been able to put together anything upstairs. All right.

Yes, there. So we have a guest room that does not have carpeting. And so that room is like together like that’s where

Bob and I’ve been sleeping.

And then I shoved a bunch of other stuff in there today.

Actually. Make the catch all.

But all the other rooms up here are getting carpeting by new carpeting because this carpet is grown dusting. And it’s finally coming tomorrow, which feels like it feels like it’s forever. But we’ve only actually been in this house since Thursday. So it’s right,

you haven’t even been there a full week.

But when you can’t unpack, it feels like a really long time, right? So we have to, we can’t put in the beds together or like, really unpack our clothing and stuff like that. So that’s very exciting for that to be done tomorrow. And then I can finally like finish settling, and it’s okay, it’s just around the corner, you can be all all settled in, you would think. But every time I turn around, there’s like another thing. Where Yeah, my husband’s just like, we should be doing this thing. I’m like, Really?

Yeah. You’re, um, yeah. So

before we get into our top, we’re gonna do a brief sidebar about this house thing.



so I, in my other time, I food blog and take recipe photos and stuff for magazine and other

all that all that

extra time that she has. So I have some cat couple cabinets that are like prop spaces. And I were setting them up in my office and at their, at our old house, they were mounted to the wall. And so this house pops, like Oh, they should be mounted to the wall, blah, blah. And I’m like, first of all, they’re like, a million pounds. Like, they’re hard to move with Bob and I’m moving them together. And also now they’re and they’re gonna be full of dishes. So, and your kids aren’t really furniture climbing or not furniture climbing age, and like they’re the cabinets are like six feet tall. So there’s various reasons why like, I don’t think they need to be mounted. So he mounted one of them and then he was mounting the other one. And he drilled a hole in a pipe.

Um, I tried so hard not to laugh

when he told me that which is the pipe for the upstairs bathroom


So we couldn’t use the upstairs shower

like water. Just come spurting out. How did he What happened? Well, he realized it was a pipe. Because Because he all of a sudden heard a different noise and was like,

Oh, fuck, and so then we had to like turn out try all the different waters. Like try all the different things upstairs to see like what it was. And he tried the shower first and water came out. So yeah. But like it was just the shower. It wasn’t like the toilet or anything like God. But then we had plumbers come out yesterday because they were they were actually coming anyway. So the plumbers fixed it, and then put drywall on and like patched it all up and stuff. And so the other, there’s no paint that matches this room, apparently,

there’s like, Oh, yeah, I guess that’s the like one room you didn’t have repainted?

Yeah, we didn’t repaint a lot of the rooms. But um, yeah, the there’s like 50 cans of paint in the basement. And not that one. Of course. So it’s like this weird spot that does not have any paint. Like it’s painted but doesn’t match, but it’s fine because it’s being covered by the cabinet mostly. But then we’re like moving the cabinet back today. And he’s like, I think we should mount this. And I’m like, What? He’s like, I can get a stand. I’m like, Oh, my God, Bob. I know. And he wanted to do other something else the other day where he was like, Oh, we can just drill a hole. I’m like, that wasn’t so well. Last time.

Oh my god joyous event.

I don’t even it’s pretty exciting. God bless

them. Every day. It’s a conversation about whether or not it’s the day when he’s gonna cut a hole in the garage to put a door in. So guys,

I went over on Thursday when they got into town and I was like helping Megan unpack her kitchen. And Bob just kept like coming in and out of the house yapping about this garage. He hates the garage, he he was met. He was annoying because there were things in the garage. He didn’t think that the movers should have put in the garage, which I told them to put in the garage. And then he was annoyed because there’s not another there’s not like a door. There’s the big garage door but there’s not like a regular door and he just kept talking about talking about the garage. And I was like, oh, okay, yeah. That was one evening and you’ve had a week of it. No wonder it’s felt like a long week.

Yeah, yeah. And then today, it was like, we have to put an awning over the basement steps because there’s, there’s like 1000 doors on this house that go outside. And one set of one door is to the basement. And so he wants an awning over that whole like situation so that water doesn’t immediately go down those stairs into the door, which it doesn’t really look like it does. So it’s like, I need to put we need to protect it because of blah, blah, like, No, you want to protect the foundation and all these things. I’m like, but it’s been that way literally for 140.

Right, like, I think it’s probably

okay. It seems fine. Like, I don’t I don’t know.

And also, you can’t really put an awning there because there’s like a window so it would like, be covered by the window or the window will be stupid. It was really stupid. And

then not.

Now he’s like, well, we just extend this roofline out to the hole, click the corner of the unlike that would look stupid too. And he’s like, well, ball. Oh, my God. It just one one project at a time.

You just pick one, but preferably The thing I want you to pick.


That is true.

Not the thing you want to do I need you to do the thing that needs to actually be done.

I think he’s just he just sees so many things that like, yeah, they probably do some things, and not necessarily an awning. But like, certain things do need to be done. But I think he just sees, like, so many things. So I’m gonna do the biggest thing on this list.

Yeah. So when we moved into our house, we moved in, like, the week before Christmas. And then in like, January or February, I had gone to the gym. And I came back. And my lovely husband was like crowbar in part of the doorframe and the kitchen off. I was like, What are you doing? And he was like, Well, I’m gonna because the kitchen is the only room and the downstairs where the trim is painted the rest. It’s like the original wood. And he said, Well, I’m going to strip the paint and take this back to the original wood.


I was like,

I’m very important.

right this minute.

Would you like to know how far he got on that project? the doorframe is still off of the frame, isn’t it?

Uh huh.

It’s been off for basically at this point, four years? Yes. Five years.

Yeah. That’s why I am not really excited about any of this project. So he’s like, I’m gonna do this thing. I’m like, are you?

Yeah, just don’t. Just don’t have him ask Alex to help him because it won’t happen.

Hey, love my husband, but it won’t happen.

where it’ll be like half done. And oh, yeah. And then all excited about it and do like half of it. And then yeah, it’d be over and then they won’t go back to.

Right. Yeah. And then they’ll have some beers and like, forget about it.

The momentum will be lost. And that’ll that’ll be it.

Yeah. That sounds about right.

Oh, man. So our actual topic this week, besides lifesize, Thanos and our husbands being really special. We wanted to talk about the concept of women supporting women and Megan, I know this was something that you in particular wanted to chat about because you you have some feelings and some opinions.

Well, yes, I do have some feelings and opinions it came to mind recently because I follow the actress Jameela Jamil. You might remember from the good place she is somewhat of a an activist in the I don’t know what’s I would say body acceptance. Yeah,

the body positivity body acceptance.


But she has been getting

dragged a lot lately basically for like things that are not even true. People are just making crap up to sell papers or, you know, British tabloids and things spread on social media and stuff like that. So it just made me think of that and how

Women are like,

basically made

in a way to automatically hate each other and think of the other. Think of other women as competition.

Yeah, we’re constantly pitted against each other.

Yes. And it is really annoying for one thing, like,

yeah, I’m very

tired of it. But also, it’s just kind of ingrained in us like, it’s almost like we can’t help it like you have to, it’s the same thing with like any other thing that you know, is wrong. You are like, it is still an active participant in it, even if you know that it’s bad, right? Like, you have to actively work against the bad behavior. Right. Um, and I think this is one of those things, just because it’s been so ingrained in us where like, you know, the whole, like weight loss thing, or like people who get the thing that you want, and like, you just are automatically meant to be meant to think that that person who is that whatever ideal weight that you think you want, or they get the job that you want, or whatever it is, like you’re supposed to automatically hate them.

Yeah, I yeah. And I feel like, well, and I feel like, especially with women, there’s like,

you know,

there are so we’re, we’re, and I feel like there’s actually, this probably, I would imagine, ends up applying to a lot of minorities, I think we can only speak as women because we are white women. We don’t belong to part to any other minority group. But you know, I think when there are particularly like in the workplace, when there tend to be fewer positions. It depending on the the industry for women, or other minority groups, that it’s like you have to compete for the one spot. And so instead of having this like actually, community over competition mindset, it just becomes the competition mindset. Mm hmm. So, yeah, I think that it can be and I think getting out of that in other areas of life and coming into a, again, like coming into that community over competition, like there’s plenty of space for us all. And like actually lifting each other up instead of like, lifting each other up, but like, only to their face when you’re like, actually, like kind of backstabbing them when the bass turns. Yeah. You know what I mean?

Yeah, and I think a lot of it has to do with like, I know, remember, we did our fashion episode, and we’re like, Why don’t women’s clothes have pockets in camera was like the patriarchy.

Right. But really,

it is. And so like, I feel like a lot of this really is the patriarchy again. Because most a lot, I think a lot of this is really I mean, it’s definitely Western society, basically, we don’t know, maybe not Western specifically, but like, the more like the super developed countries, it was just not the right word, either that I’m thinking of,

like g8 countries, I guess.

where, like, we are meant to, you know, be subservient to men, and you’re not supposed to be women are not supposed to be successful. And we are just supposed to, like, live for the man and do what they do and stuff. And then even while like that was going on women, obviously we form on bonds, we, you know, in the olden times, people would like, you know, have their knitting circle and you know,

knit a giant lifesize Thanos together Oh, wait, probably not that.

But you know, you wouldn’t, you know, you’d all get together to like, you know, make a new quilt for a new bride, or, you know, you’d all make bread for the whole town on one day or something and stuff like that and take care of each other’s children. Right. But also, those kinds of things. We’re kind of, after a point of time, they’re kind of discouraged, because it was like women being together

in a row, not any men, like

supervising them.

Oh, well, what if they would if they plot,

right because it

I mean, in a way women were plotting because we were fighting for the right to vote or fighting for equal rights and things like that. But that means Pete, according to then, at that time, at least like a woman, we’re trying to For them, and reduce their power, and that was very scary to them. And so I feel like a lot of the ways that they like worked really hard to make sure women weren’t doing those things was to instill this idea of like, women should not be friends, women are your competition. We are going to make sure that you know, you only think that certain women are worthy of things, but you’re supposed to also hate them while you love them.

So look up to people in the magazines, but also hate them.

I feel like I listened to man, I feel like I listened to a podcast episode of something recently that was kind of talking about this. And like the evolution like essentially the evolution of female, female and female male relationships. And yeah, that there is there was a point in time where, like, it just sort of became like too scary, too many too scary.

Well, I wonder if it’s the same thing that I listened to, too, because they were it was another The other thing that that I listened to was similar to that, but it was also talking a little bit about male male friendships to and how those like, like, it used to be more common for men to have, like very loving close relationships with each other. Mm hmm. And I wonder if that was, if that was the same thing.

Do we read this in big friendship?


That would make sense.

I don’t have the book sitting here next to me or I would be thumbing through it. But I’m like, looking through my podcast feed. I’m like, What did I listen to? Like, I felt like it was something I listened to. But maybe it was maybe it was reading big friendship. Maybe it’s whatever makes

sense if we are both thinking about the same thing.

Yeah. Cuz as soon as you said like, it was the same as like, if that was indeed what it was willing to, in the show notes people.


Yeah, I think it is. It’s just fascinating. I think how we’ve kind of create created that myth, like we’ve gone along with it. That’s the thing like it’s created by men, mostly. But we’ve got along with it. Yes. For the longest time and

a long time.

Most of us, many of us are trying to fight back against it. But it’s so hard. Yeah.

So something that we have kind of,

I guess, glommed on to as a society.

Is this idea of the queen bee? Mm hmm. Absolutely. So it’s interesting, because the there’s an article in The New York Times that will link to this quote that you pulled out. And it’s, it’s Sheryl Sandberg talking about basically this myth of the queen bee. It says queen bees exists, but they’re far less common than we think. Women aren’t any meaner to women than men are to one another. Women are just expected to be nicer. We stereotype men as aggressive and women is kind when women violate those stereotypes, we judge them harshly, harshly. Which is interesting. And and we think about this a lot. I know that, that you and I, in particular, talk about it a lot. In different aspects of life. A lot of times it’ll be work, but not always work. Sometimes it’s you know, if we read a story about something will often say would they be saying this if this person was male instead of female? Mm. Like, would we be all saying, Oh, she’s such a bitch, or will we be saying like, if it was a man would we’d be like, Oh, yeah, they just get out there. And they just, they get it done. And they they see it they get what they want. And so I think it is interesting when you’re like really take a step back and think like yeah, women are actually just, they’re like, meaner to their counterparts than men are to one another. We just are supposed to in this social contract. Be nice to each other.

Yeah, we’re just always supposed to be nice all the time. And like How many times have you been told by someone that you should smile more?


every single woman every single woman has had that said to them hundreds of times, lesions smile more, or you should just like you’re walking down the street and you should just smile like, first of all, no one walks on the street smiling to themselves, because that’s

fucking creepy. Only loons do. They’re

not gonna be walking around going

right now. Um,

but it is this weird thing where like, you Do you think back to the 2016 election? Even in just the primaries, where it’s like, well, you can’t listen to what Hillary Clinton says, because she’s so shrill and right does all these wrong things I’m like, because you compare her to Bernie Sanders who was like literally screaming, during debate, right? Or during his speeches. And you watch her and she’s just speaking like a poised, intelligent woman. And you’re like, What? What exactly is going on here?

Right? It’s insane. It is, it is. And we, anytime a woman dares to assert herself in any kind of way. Then she gets labeled as a bit rubbish. Yeah.


you know, that’s, that’s not now.

Sometimes, are we being bitchy? Yes.

That’s like, I so Okay, I’m gonna rabbit trail here for a minute. It’s like when people are like, we should eliminate the word bossy from our vocabulary, they’re exhibiting leadership skills. I do not agree with that. Because I think there’s a difference between exhibiting leadership skills and being bossy.

That is true. I agree with that.

Because being bossy does not automatically mean you’re being a leader. Sometimes you’re just being bossy. Yes, so I also think that men can be bossy. I call my husband bossy all the time. So don’t come at me and be like what you call a man bossy? Yes, I do call man bossy. All the time. I live with him. He’s married to me. So I want to say like, yes, there are times that like, there are times I’m just straight up being a bitch. Mm hmm. And then there are times when I am just asserting myself and standing up for myself or standing up for someone else, or, you know, whatever. And that gets deemed as being bitchy. Because it’s not being warm and cuddly. Yeah, like, why do we, as women, when we write have to write emails, in the work world, that are not the greatest, like, maybe it’s not the happiest email we’ve ever had to send, maybe we’re, you know, not happy about something. And we have to tell the person, we’re not happy about this thing. But then we like still feel the need to like, throw in an exclamation point.

To have an exclamation point. And you have to have nice words. And you have to say, Please, and one of the things that women do a lot in emails that I’ve been trying not to do after ever since I learned about this study, and realized it was true for me is that women, a lot of times when they’re sending emails, send, I just wanted to blah, blah, blah. where it’s like, all you have to do is say, you know, where is the thing that I need? Like, I need this thing. But yeah, so instead, women are like, I just wanted to check in and make sure that, like I

said, like, 87 just checking in on. Yeah, emails a day.

Yes, exactly. And when men don’t do that, like women, that’s the thing women do. Like men just say, like, I we’re still waiting for this thing.

Right? Right. But then there is also

because, you know, sometimes those sometimes those emails are going to clients. And so as someone who is in a client services position. I also know if I send an email that says, I need this, where is it? Then they’re going to be like, Oh, she’s such a bitch. We’re not going to work with her again. Yeah. So there’s this like, okay, I don’t want to play the game. But I’m also have to, I have to, I feel like if I don’t play the game, then I’ll lose the game.

Yeah, there is this comedian, a comedian slash writer, who lately has been getting pretty popular because she, she is the person. I don’t know if you’re on Twitter. And I think maybe she does on Instagram, too. She takes the President’s speeches and then like, dubs them to like her acting them out. And she did share. She’s very funny. But she also has written a bunch of books. And I saw this going around recently. I she wrote, The book is actually a few years old, but it’s called to be how to how to be successful without hurting men’s feelings.

Oh, there

is a section within the book that is basically like a picture of a man and a picture of a woman. And they’re saying the same thing. And then it like gives the example of like the man, how the man, what the man is saying is like totally fine and good. And what the woman is saying is like, super offensive or bad. And I just had to laugh because it’s so true. Like, the if you go to Amazon, which will link the actual book, they have a little preview of the book. And it shows the example that they have on there, as they’re both saying, your document needs a lot more work. And the man it says that he’s helpful. And the woman says that she is abrasive.

And I was like, yeah,


So true. You’re like, it’s so true. It’s not funny.

Yes, it’s funny, but also like, in a really sad way. Right? Like,

I don’t want to talk about it.

Yeah. Ah, it’s just because of those things. That’s the reason why it is in intrinsically hard for women to support each other. Unless they have been shown by other women how to do that.

Yes. Yeah, I think that you’re absolutely right. A think that you have to learn it from somebody else. Like, this is like I am going to support you. And stop, not, I am going to support you until you become more successful than I am. And I feel threatened, or I’m going to support you, and then

talk about you behind your back, or I’m going to support you, because if I support you, then you’ll support me and I will get something out of it.

Right. It just has to be

your I am going to support you. Right. And


no strings attached. It’s not

like it’s one of the one of the good things that I saw come out of COVID. It was everyone taking up the idea of how to support your friends in their business, online business mostly, and their, you know, side hustles. And all their little endeavors as something that has been has come up for bloggers for years. But during COVID because everyone was quarantined. This kind of thing came up a lot more often for other industries. And so on social media, it was going around a lot. Somebody actually that previous guest, Kathleen recently had shared I think, a couple of weeks ago, maybe about how to support each other. And it was like, share your friends business on Facebook. Like, Share them, share them on social media, leave them a review, like there’s so many things you can do. that don’t necessarily mean like, oh my to support my friend, I have to buy their thing.

Like right, you don’t have to

write, you don’t have to feel like you need to buy everyone’s thing. Right, right. That’s how everyone gets sucked sucked into MLM, right?

Then have like, 12,000 pairs of LuLaRoe leggings in your house, right?

But there’s like this weird thing where people feel like it’s so much work to actually support each other. And it’s really not.

No, I supported my friend, Kathleen today, because she was on the news. And she because she and her friends started a new like jewelry company. They’ve been making these really cute mask chains. And they were on the local Sacramento news this morning. And she I found the like live streaming link and I watched the new segment. I knew what time she was gonna be on. I knew our she was gonna be on and I watched her new segment.

That’s awesome. I was it.

Not that hard. I also like because I have some media relations experience when she told me that they were going to be on the news. I was like, Okay, sure. Some of my media training tips. Here are some of the tips I learned when I had clients that were going on the news. That’s it. Yeah, I didn’t expect her to like send me free shit. I didn’t expect her to like shout me out. I’m not expecting like any like anything. I just told her like a gave her some tips so that they could, you know, be feel prepared and confident going into their new segment. And then I watched it. It took like three it was three. It was a three minute segment. It took three minutes of my life to be supportive and watch my friends new segment. Yeah. And then of course Boomerang it on stories because if it didn’t go on its azorius didn’t even happen but like, you know, it just doesn’t especially with the way that social media is now it’s so easy to on Instagram to share a post to your stories, or to I don’t really understand how Tick Tock works. But people share shit from Tick Tock on other platforms all the time. So like, you know, there’s just so many different ways that you can share somebody like what somebody is doing, even if it because again, like, I don’t think you have to if your friend is doing something like that doesn’t mean you have to buy their stuff because not everything is for everyone. It might not be your style of thing, but it might be somebody who knows style of thing. Yeah, they might be looking for it. And so they, you know, they might be like, oh, I’ve actually been looking for whatever.

Yeah, and I think too. The other thing to remember is that you also if you’re supporting somebody, you don’t have to do it publicly. Yep, like, that doesn’t have to be a thing that that trips you up. I think I’m one of those people who’s very nervous about like, energy vampires. Uh, huh. I’m very protective of my time, obviously. So like, I, I want to support people, but also like, I want to make sure that I do it on my own terms. Yes. So I don’t get sucked into like this rabbit hole of like, supporting other people. And so, like, you just like send someone a text and be like, hey, that thing you did was cool. Or an Instagram dm on their share or anything like that, like, that is still good.

You’re like the queen. For me. You’re one of my like, Queens of the like, stealth support. Like, just all the sudden, like, if I’m going through hard time or something exciting is happening. Like I’ll have a little like, a little gift from Megan. Or like a little text or just like unexpected just a little like I love you. thing that just like happens. It’s it’s stealth. She’s stealth loves you. But like, you know, it’s not there’s not a big like, Oh, I’m gonna do blah, blah, blah. Like it just happens. the right spirit quietly like you sneak it in there.

Yeah, I think it’s funny. It’s it’s kind of it’s related to like the idea of female friendships, I think in like the age of social media, where people feel like everybody needs to share everything all the time.


And pretty much every time I get together with my friends. We don’t take any pictures ever.

Oh, I always forget.

Well, then I get to the end. I’m like, well, crap. I don’t have any pictures of

that. I had a really good time. Right? Because we’re so into having a good time. And not being like, we have to take 25,000 selfies, right? Which I you know, if that’s your thing, I guess that’s cool. But also like, just because you’re not documenting it necessarily for the world to see. does not mean that you are not in supportive female friendships,

right? It just makes a lot of people get

hung up on the squad thing.

Yes, the squad. The squad is the thing.

Yeah, I definitely getting to be less of a thing, but

I don’t know. I don’t

know. I think so. Um, I mean, I think it’s important to have your, your group. Yeah, I think it’s important to have your group but I don’t think it has to be like, this is my hashtag squad squad goals. Hashtag squad. Like, if I ask someone else to tell me like to say, like, Who’s your squad? Hmm. I don’t know that. Anyone who’s not like in the squad could tell you, right? Because I’m not constantly like sharing like, Oh, this is my little group.

Mm hmm. It just feels so I don’t know.

So like at playground? Yes. You know, like, so I remember when I was in was the second or third grade. There was this whole thing with two different groups of girls. And both groups of girls were like trying to claim one of the people as their best friend.


And it was like the war basically, between these two groups of friends. It was the worst thing. And I feel like that is kind of what still is happening. Mm hmm. And I I just don’t really understand like we’ve been talking about this. I feel like we could talk about it for a really long time and still not really understand the why the why of why we are just always battling each other.

Yeah, I because I experienced and I definitely like experienced this And I mean, I’ve experienced this at a few points in my life. But like I, when I was in college, I became friends with Aaron last week’s guest. She was living with a couple other girls. And we, there was a group of four of us and we went on, like a Christmas break trip to Florida. And over the course of that trip, one of the other girls that kind of figured out that Aaron and I had become super close. And we’re kind of becoming better friends than she and Aaron, where shinnick lost her shit about it. Like, completely, just couldn’t handle it. Yeah. And it wasn’t like, we were being like, No, you can’t be friends with us. She just, I think she just wanted to, like be the bestie. Or could it handle that our relationship was different than the relationship was like, I’ve seen this play out in numerous different ways in over the course of my life. Like, it’s just, I think, like, sometimes we’re like, but I have to be that person’s best friend. Like, Are you someone else’s best friend great. Like, I don’t know, it’s just it’s very strange to me. I think

we all have that. A for lack of a better way of saying it. FOMO

Yes, we

were like, you know, if, like, you and I are very good friends, obviously. But like, if you are awfully you go off and do something with your other friends. Like, I because I’m adult. I’m not like, Oh, am I gonna sit down doing something without me? But I might be a little bit like, Oh, well, that sounds like fun.

That would be cool to do later. Like, I’m not gonna be like, Oh, I really want to go and crush the party. Right? You’re not gonna sit around and like, stick your lip out. And, uh, nobody loves me. I guess I’ll eat worms, right? Like you’re

I there was someone I was reading. And I can’t remember who said it. I almost want to say it was Glennon. But I don’t know if it was. But the concept of like, where your heart is? Not a container. Mm hmm. Where you can have relationships with infinite people. Mm hmm. And it’s not, you’re not going to run out of heartspace.

Right? You don’t love you don’t run out of love. Love is not finite, finite?

Yes. It’s the same thing with friendships. Your friendships are not finite. Like, yes, there’s time that you need to spend and you might have a loan amount of time. Yeah. But if I don’t talk to you, one day, I’m not gonna be like, Oh, my God. Our friendship is over.

Oh, she hates me.

Talk to you. like it’d be weird.

It is weird all the days where I’m like, I really didn’t talk too much today. But I’m also not like, Oh my god, she must hate me. Our friendship is over.

Right. Exactly. It’s that’s why we you know, if you have friends, you made it at any point in the past? If you haven’t seen them for a long time, and then you do see them again. And you kind of just like pick up again. Yes, that’d be like, so how’s the weather? Right? Or like that weird thing where you go to a reunion, you just kind of all talk about like, either high school or like, try to catch up for like, the last five years. Yeah, but if you’re a really good friends, you just kind of keep going on. And just yeah, whatever you do,

pick up. It’s whatever. Sometimes there’s a little bit of like, okay, what’s new with whatever? Mm hmm. But it doesn’t there’s you just, it just is I could go I could go weeks without talking to Aaron, and then pick up and be like, Oh, yeah. And there are friends that I talked to literally every day, like I have, I have my everyday texting friends. And then I have friends that I talked to like, once a week, once every couple weeks, and I’m not any closer or further. It like friendship wise, with one than the other. It’s just a different kind of relationship, different personalities. Like I, I just they are different people. And so those are different friendships and relationships. But this, this idea of like not having this like finite amount of love like that. Also, I feel like I feel like a lot of this can in a lot of ways play into the adoption space. Particularly when we’re talking about open adoptions, like I think, particularly mothers and adoptive mothers can feel very threatened by birth mothers and like, worried that they’re, you know, having a really open relationship with their child’s birth mother will take away from their motherhood in some way. And which absolutely doesn’t because again, love is not finite like my child can love me as her mother and also love Taylor as her mother. Those two things are not mutually exclusive. And so you know this heart I feel like there’s there’s some tie ins here that because that because I do and I mean, yeah, the adoption space a lot of times you are seeing birth mothers and not as many birth fathers. But I feel like this, this women pitted against each other narrative affects so many areas of life like at work, and personal relationships. And, like, I think it has seeped into these these mothering relationships and all of these different things.

Oh, man, the mothering space, just in general, the

mother space in general is fucking why all of you are in for a ride.

I got only seven months in and it is wild. It is a wild.

It’s crazy. I mean, it’s one of the reasons honestly, like I’m not friends with a lot of moms. Mm hmm. Like I’m friends with moms because I’m friends with them already. Right. But I’m not like, I did not really become friends with any of my kids. Friends, parents. Sure. Partially because it’s like, I’m a I’m a weird friendship person, as you know.

It’s fine.

But I didn’t want the only thing that we had in common was that we had kids, right? in the same class. Yeah. But there’s the competition level is just ridiculous and stupid. Because like, especially when they’re like four or five years old.

Who cares? Right? Okay, really doesn’t matter.

Right? I mean, like, even, like, I’ve even I’ve felt this to some degree. Because I weirdly know a number of people who had babies, like within a few weeks on either side of when Eden was born. Mm hmm. And so there are all these babies that are clustered together within the span of a few weeks. And and of course, all the moms are posting their, you know, monthly pictures. And, you know, his, you know, post so and so is six months old this month. And I mean, I do it too. Mostly I do it because I’m trying to share with birth family, which is actually the only reason that I’m probably doing it. But everybody does it. It’s the thing. And, like, even they’ll be like, you know, oh, they started crawling this bot and I’m like, my daughter’s not crawling yet. Oh, my God. Or they’ll be like, Oh, so they’re, they’re cruising down. I’m like, oh my god. She’s not pulling herself up yet. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. What’s Oh my God, is my child really behind? Like, you just fall into this? Like, I don’t know. It’s really weird. And stupid. And it’s just weird.

Yeah, no, it’s totally. It’s,

it’s it is weird. It’s weird with their babies. Because, like, you do want to make sure that there’s nothing wrong with them. Right. But it does feel like this crazy competition.

Because then there’s also like, if you read the baby books, they’ll it’ll even say, like, there will be like, a four month span of time when babies typically tend to demonstrate a certain milestone or skill. And, and it literally, like it’ll emphasize in there, like, this is the typical range, meaning that there are babies that are gonna fall on either side. And you could be like at the beginning of that range, and somebody will post like, Oh, so and so pulled themselves up. And I’m like, Oh my god, she didn’t pull herself up yet. Oh, my God, she hasn’t purposefully said mama or daddy. Oh my god, like you’re in. You know, in your head. You’re like, you’re being stupid. And yet there it is. Like it’s just already that competition of like, it’s my child keeping up late Yeah. Is what am I going to have to say this month when I share her picture? Am I gonna have any any good milestone to share? Like, I’m gonna say is she’s really fucking cute. Like the end. She continued to be the cutest baby in the world compete with that. I don’t know. It’s wild.


it is definitely me a parent in my parenting. It’s definitely different because it’s like that, you know? It’s your kid. So you definitely feel that extra protection level. Yeah. And so you feel like you have to like break On your kids, but the competition is just like it’s just crazy. Yeah.

So how how do we get past this?


yeah, that sounds right.

I mean, you know, I do think I think that when we start

being mindful of

the voices that we’re taking in on social media, Mm hmm. Then it starts to change our mindset a little bit. Yeah, it’s kind of like the trash and trash out mindset. Absolutely. So, you know, if you’re, if you’re following people,


you, like, are they the type that seemed to just shout out their friends and lift up their friends and talk about how, how proud they are? And do they share? You know, maybe they’re, you know, they’ve got a certain niche that they fall in, like, are they sharing the content of their, quote, competitors? And, you know, just to be supportive? Like, I think there’s lots of ways that you can kind of tell, like, Is someone doing this for real? Or are they doing things? To to look good? Tonight? I mean,

yeah, no,

I think I think like, even though it’s social media, and there is always a level of like, do you I know them in person, I think you can tell when people are being genuine. And following people like Jameela Jamil, Glennon Doyle, Kristen Bell, I think does a really good job of this. There’s a lot of women that I follow in the adoption space that I think are really amazing at this.

It starts to change your mindset. Mm hmm.

That, you know, what, we can just share things. Because it’s the right thing to do to like, lift up other women without any

need for recognition?


Like, I agree, just do something nice.

I think

I think too, one of the other things that people should do, if you happen to be employed, is to do what you can to promote the work of the people that you work with.


you know, if somebody does a great job on something, like, tell them the year like, you know, hey, you did a great job on that, or thank them for their help on something. If you could do that in a semi public way, that’s even better.

You know, we have

phone calls, like team phone calls. And sometimes it’s, it works out really well to be able to say that like on a call to someone, you can hear a voice actually saying like, Hey, you did a really good job on there. Like, I really appreciate your help on this thing. Yep. That is not only like supporting the work that they do, but also like, is really good for like your work.

Mental health,

yes. feel appreciated.

But if you’re talking to other people, maybe not on your team, and you can find a way to promote that person. Yes, with or the work that they do not like ness, you know, you’re not trying to get them to get a different job or anything, but like, a situation where you’re like, Oh, you know, Stephie would be perfect to do that thing. Like that is the kind of support that women need on the job.

Or if you like, as someone in a managerial role, like, if someone says like, Oh, Stephie good job on landing that client. Like, I tried to say, you know, it wasn’t just me, like, you know, this other person really did so much work on this proposal. Like, I couldn’t have done it without this person. Yeah. You know, making sure that the people who run the company know that the people who are technically below me are doing great.

Yeah, like, because it’s not just about like you telling the person that they’re doing great, like, it’s important to tell the people above you. Mm hmm.

And that’s been working on it.

And honestly, like, we’re doing it because it’s the right thing to do. But I’ve never had that actually. Like I’ve never had that workout bad for me. Do you know what I mean like that has never come back to bite me in the ass. I mean, how would it? I mean, I guess, you know, like people, anyone, I think that’s what I think that’s like this myth that people have in their head like, Oh, well, if I tell my boss, that someone below me did a really good job on something, they’re going to think that they’re better at my job than I am at my job and that they should have my job. And that’s not that’s not necessarily how it goes, like, lifting up my, my colleagues and the people that are reporting to me has only ever, like been good for me. Mm hmm. So even though that’s not why I do it, I’ve never had it come back to bite me in the ass. So

yeah, no, I think this is good. I mean, it’s just good practice in general. Like, don’t be very especially it’s, it’s especially important for women to like, get those nose and also to be able to make their voices heard.

I was it reading?

Oh, I got I don’t want to say it was big friendship again. I was reading something recently about in Obama’s White House. The women that worked there, they started like, bumping up each other. So they would be in a meeting and then be like, Oh,

I think it wasn’t like friendship. Yeah.

Stephie just

said this really good thing. Like, let’s like go back to what she said. Like basically like, doubling down on what that person said. Yes. To make sure that those women’s voices were heard basically just really love big friendship.

Yeah, basically, we’re obsessed. Everyone should read it.

It ties in very well does. Um,

well, because they so they wait, though they have shine theory. Let’s talk about shine theory. Yeah, so they explain shine theory in the book and the the authors of the book I mean not to so and and Friedman came up with this kind of philosophy way of life. And they’ve been writing about it for a while. And a lot of people have talked about it, but they’re the ones that kind of deemed it shine theory. And the idea is that you lift up other people without expectation of them coming back and lifting you up. And that when you do that, you’re everybody shines. Yep. Like when you shine on other people, you also shine Just by, by the nature of it. And so, like, it’s definitely, it’s definitely a great book to read for this topic. Because they it’s that’s absolutely what they’re doing with shine theory. They’re talking like, you just you lift other people up, and stop, you don’t expect something back, you don’t like, Oh, I’m gonna give you a boost. So that next week, you’ll give me a boost. You just do it because it’s the fucking right thing to do. Mm hmm.

That’s it. And I think that’s it, I think,

yeah. And I think when you if you start to feel like those competitive feelings, or those, you know, queen bee ish type thoughts, or those not nice feelings. That’s like a really good hint to yourself to like, look inside yourself and figure out like, why am I feeling this way? What is it that I have learned over the years then makes me have this gut reaction? Yes. And kind of explore that instead of just like, automatically going into whatever your reaction you’re not nice reaction might be. And I’m not saying that, like, we have to be nice all the time, like we already covered,

right? You don’t have to be nice all the time.

But out being nice, necessarily. It’s just Bs, you know, knowing

if something triggers you Yeah. And if something is triggering you, there’s usually like a reason why it’s triggering you. Right? And again, like not to harp on the adoption connection, but we talk about this a lot in the adoption community. Like, when we read something, and it really like picks at us. There’s usually a reason. And a lot of times it’s because we’re reading something, or we’re seeing something that we’re seeing reflected in ourselves that we don’t necessarily like, yeah, and so that might be a cue that we need to like, think on that and do some inner work. And so if this idea of lifting up other women just just doing it, if that’s really difficult like take Step and like think about like, Okay, why is why am I having a hard time with this? Or if you get, you know, if your friend does have some success and you’re so jealous, like, kind of take a step and be like, why am I so jealous about this? Mm hmm. Like I I, is there something that I need to like work on? Like, there’s probably something else going on that, you know, you probably need to just like take take a beat and

do little inner work. Yeah.

I think that is a good place to end. Yeah, absolutely.

also go to therapy. But

yeah, that’s true. That’s a whole nother

What’s bringing us joy?

Stephie. Yes. What is bringing you joy this week?

Well, I feel like maybe I started off way too strong out of the gate with the lifesize Thanos, because that’s it brings me a lot of joy. I’m not, I’m not gonna lie to you. But we are gonna go apple picking this weekend. I’m so excited. So excited, and a couple friends are coming into town. And so we’re gonna have like a girls trip to the apple orchard. It’s gonna be such a good weekend. I’m so excited. I’m pretty sure my entire family is coming in. So it’ll be girls and also my family, but make them go hang out by themselves. Like they have to go do something else. Well, the girls hang out.

Inherently there are multiple activities for children. There actually are.

Yeah, I was looking at there. And it’s like there’s a corn maze. And there’s

like some sort of slingshot thing.

Oh, the boys will probably have a blast. So honestly, they will probably want to go off with and like do that stuff while we actually pick apples.

Yes, that’s fine. I’m fine with that. They can

they can drive in a separate car though. And then we will eat all the doughnuts. Oh my gosh. And Apple fritters? Oh my god, I’m so excited. I’m so Eric

cyta cider. I want to come on with all the apple cider. My kids are very excited about the apple cider.

Apple cider is the best I love a nice mulled cider. So good. So that is bringing me joy. Very excited.

Excellent. How about you? Well, I went to the farmers market this past week.

We have a cute little farmers market

right cute little farmers market. I could walk to it from my house so great. It’s amazing. The seasons kind of widening down so it’s a little bit smaller than a probably normally is plus the covids.

Like that’s it’s a it’s a weird Cobos. Yeah.

I assume probably during normal times, like it goes around the whole square.

It does. Yeah, there’s one day block off Washington Street. But on three sides of the square, it’s like packed.

Yeah. So there’s definitely there was a land maybe like 10 booths or something like that. But it was very lovely. And there’s a wide variety of fruits and vegetables. My son’s very excited because they had pears that he loves pears. Oh, yes. Ah, and I got so overwhelmed because I hadn’t really like thought about what to get at the farmers market.

Well, you have to kind of scope and see what’s even available. You know,

that’s true.

And so that’s what we walked around for a little bit. And then I was like, Okay, now I’m gonna go back and like, pick out some things. But I didn’t like think ahead to be like, what, what, what am I looking for from the farmers market to make? Uh huh. So I was kind of just like, what speaking to me like, what should I get? So, I ended up with some butternut squash, of course, a leak, because I thought that was a good idea. I just bought one leak like what am i single? Luckily, you goof. I don’t know what’s wrong with me.

I wasn’t in the right mind. I don’t know.


The pears? Uh huh. I’m green beans. Uh, what else can I get? I got a pound. I got those little like, tiny, like red fingerling kind potato? Uh huh. Not like red ones, but they’re like more purple ish. Yes, I can’t what kind there but they were super cheap. I was thrilled. And I got some meat too. So

all there you make like a lovely soup with the squash and you’re one leak and some of the shallot.

Yeah, that’s probably what I’m gonna do. I was gonna make tacos but the kids are always like butternut squash tacos but I’ve made them like many times before and it’s always ends up fine but there was complained about it when somebody would just make soup for myself.

Alex made French onion soup, less Night and it was it was really good.

That does sound good. It was delicious.

Yeah, so I’m excited.

It’s because for a few more weeks and then I guess it moves and goes inside.

Yeah, they have like a once a month indoor market situation, although you are going to be getting the winter CSA. So

am I excited for you made sure to join that right away? I’m sure it’s gonna be all fruit, vegetables and tail.

So, you know, I think they’re good. I think they’re doing popcorn. They were saying all CSA members are getting popcorn I think I saw in the Facebook group. So that’s exciting. And then there’s usually a really big Thanksgiving market. Oh, they do the Saturday before Thanksgiving. So I usually get most of my produce at that market. And, and usually like, I’ll get some like honey or jam or something for our charcuterie board and there’s usually flowers and all sorts of fun stuff. So I’m hoping that that’ll still be that’ll still be a thing this year for our or Thanksgiving. But yeah, it’s a it’s a nice little market.

So yeah, it’s cute. It was a i didn’t i didn’t chop it every booth but there’s enough variety. I think that I could definitely like get all my foods if I wanted to. And it was kind of cool, because there was this squash type that I had never seen before. Hmm. It was a candy. A candy roaster squash.

Oh, I think I’ve those really kind of new I don’t there had them before. But I’ve seen them on social media because I’m a freak.

So I don’t follow normal people. Well, yeah, well, I’m afraid so I took a picture of it. So I could Google it later. Um, so they’re very big, like, really long, like twice as long as a butternut squash basically. But they are actually like, called they were cultivated by a Native American tribe.

Oh, I

can’t remember which one it was now.

I’ll have to look it up. So we can add it to our show notes later. But it’s like an heirloom variety and I must be

coming back. Interesting. Did you get one? No, I

did not buy one because I didn’t know what it was. And so the next week next if they have them next week, I will buy one if

you have they have a nice week. You got to absolutely get one of those good

things very delicious roasted so

that you love winter squash.

I love squash actually, Edie really loves butternut squash. Perfect I’ve roasted some butternut squash for her and she’s been like chewed out when down on it. I knew there was a reason I liked her. Oh my gosh, she’s so funny. Like she just because you know we’re kind of doing this like mix of purees I don’t feel that many periods anymore. But periods like kind of baby wet lady and so did I say that right? Baby led weaning?

I think it’s a baby when

something I don’t know.

Baby led weaning up, bless my heart. Um, and so it’s sometimes whatever we’ve had the night before for dinner. I just give her some leftovers. And so she’s she had some Italian beef this week, and the girlfriend was not at all fazed by like the pepperoncini peppers in there. She was like a young given more like, man.

She’s my good little eater. She’s a funny little duck.

Next week’s episode

Well, next week, we are going to talk about Halloween.

I have a lot of feelings about this holiday. So I really do. I got a lot so y’all buckle up. It’s gonna be a bumpy ride. So until then, leave us a review on Apple podcasts and listen to us on your favorite platform. You can also follow us on social media at irsipodcast or send us an email at We’d love to hear from you.

Talk to you soon.

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